Episode #223: From Iraq to EOS: Why Every Leader Needs a Coaching Team with Hark Herold

Hark Herold brings three decades of military precision to the entrepreneurial world. As a retired U.S. Air Force colonel turned EOS implementer, Hark shares how his leadership experience in high-stakes environments—from serving in Desert Storm to overseeing base recovery during rocket attacks in Iraq —shaped his approach to business.

Now, he empowers small and medium-sized businesses to build clarity, cohesion, and execution with the Entrepreneurial Operating System (EOS). In this episode, Hark explains why leadership alignment is non-negotiable, how ego can cripple growth, and what it means to have the “right people in the right seats.” He also highlights resources available for veteran-owned businesses and shares why coaching is essential, even when all the tools are already at your fingertips.

Want to learn more about Hark Herold's work? Check out their website at https://www.eosworldwide.com/hark-herold.

Connect with Hark Herold on LinkedIn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/joeharkherold/.

Key Points & Timestamps

01:00 — Introducing Hark Herold: Air Force colonel and EOS implementer
02:20 — Hark’s military entry and Desert Storm experience
06:00 — Bouncing across Air Force roles and managing diverse teams
07:15 — Base recovery leadership during rocket attacks in Iraq
10:00 — Problem-solving under fire: improving base clearance operations
11:00 — Transition to civilian life and avoiding defense contracting
12:00 — Supporting veteran-owned businesses and incubators
14:00 — How Hark discovered EOS through Bunker Labs
15:00 — What is EOS? Vision, Traction, and Healthy Teams
17:00 — Why coaching matters more than just reading the book
20:00 — Accountability at all levels of leadership
22:00 — Matching the right coach with the right team
23:00 — EOS concepts: vision, right seats, and tough people decisions
25:00 — The “36 hours of pain” in leadership decisions
26:00 — Veteran business resources most vets don’t know about
28:00 — How to reach Hark and get support for veteran-led startups

Transcript

00;00;00;00 - 00;00;30;20
Craig Andrews
I was in a coma for six weeks while the doctors told my wife I was going to die. When I woke up, she told me the most fantastic story. My team kept running the business without me. Freelancers reached out to my team and said, we will do whatever it takes. As long as Craig's in the hospital. I consider that the greatest accomplishment in my career.

00;00;30;23 - 00;00;51;10
Craig Andrews
My name is Craig Andrews and this is the Leaders and Legacies podcast where we talk to leaders creating an impact beyond themselves. At the end of today's interview, I'll tell you how you can be the next leader featured on this show.

00;00;51;10 - 00;01;22;05
Craig Andrews
Today I will welcome Hark Herold. He is a retired US Air Force colonel and a professional EOS implementer. He helps entrepreneurial leadership teams gain clarity, traction and results. He brings over 30 years of combined military and business leadership experience, empowers organizations to grow strategically and operate with discipline, vision and purpose. Hark, welcome.

00;01;22;08 - 00;01;23;28
Hark Herold
Thanks, Craig. How are you doing today?

00;01;24;00 - 00;01;27;25
Craig Andrews
I'm doing great. I'm doing great. The,

00;01;27;25 - 00;01;33;27
Craig Andrews
So it's always good to have a veteran on, you know, and I, I was guessing years ago, I was,

00;01;33;27 - 00;01;47;01
Craig Andrews
Well, a couple years ago, I was guesting on a podcast run by another event, and it was funny. He said it was a live show, and he told me after we were done, he was like, you know, he said there were people messaging me in the chat.

00;01;47;01 - 00;02;01;12
Craig Andrews
If you all knew each other. And and he was like, no, no, we just met. But, you know, it's it's a unique community that absolutely. Yeah. I,

00;02;01;12 - 00;02;04;13
Craig Andrews
I was in during mostly peaceful times.

00;02;04;13 - 00;02;14;02
Craig Andrews
You know, we had the first Gulf War when I was in, but I was deployed to Japan, and they decided to keep us over there and keep North Korea in check.

00;02;14;04 - 00;02;20;14
Craig Andrews
But you I mean, certainly you got in some dust up somewhere.

00;02;20;17 - 00;02;21;11
Hark Herold
Yeah. So,

00;02;21;11 - 00;02;26;15
Hark Herold
so I was also in I. So I was commissioned in 1989,

00;02;26;15 - 00;02;30;24
Hark Herold
and went over to Saudi for Desert Shield Desert Storm.

00;02;30;24 - 00;02;35;06
Hark Herold
And, that was cool. Was the second lieutenant that was very,

00;02;35;06 - 00;02;50;25
Hark Herold
a unique experience to be able to see all of that. And we were at a, revealing wing base in Saudi, where on the night the air were kicked off, we had 99 air refueling jets on the ground getting ready to go out on missions,

00;02;50;25 - 00;02;54;07
Hark Herold
which was just incredible.

00;02;54;10 - 00;02;56;09
Hark Herold
That so that.

00;02;56;09 - 00;03;04;07
Craig Andrews
Quick, quick question, how long before the strikes did you know when the strikes were happening?

00;03;04;09 - 00;03;26;01
Hark Herold
That day, I mean, when we did the mission brief for the flights, like, hey, it's a go, like, okay, bring everybody in, do all the mission briefs, you get all the air crews in the in the theater and the Intel, and then and all the flight routes and all the deconfliction and. Yeah. So, I mean, it's been planned forever, right?

00;03;26;01 - 00;03;36;15
Hark Herold
I mean, not forever, but, you know, been planning towards it, but then the goal was, okay, you know, tomorrow's tomorrow's the the day or the night. Okay.

00;03;36;18 - 00;04;00;10
Craig Andrews
Yeah. Yeah. Because I remember a lot of night missions. We were using air, you know, taking every advantage we had and flying at night. Yeah. You know, it's funny, I, you know, I see the TV shows, and I have people, you know, the TV shows are like, hey, I've got clearance. You can read me in and people ask me about that, like, yeah, that's not how it works.

00;04;00;12 - 00;04;06;28
Hark Herold
No need to know is the the key criteria. Do you need to know.

00;04;07;01 - 00;04;24;12
Craig Andrews
Well and there's you know I think there's a I think there's an application for civilian life. You know, people love gossip. And there be times where I'll stop somebody. I'm like, whoa, whoa, whoa. I don't want to know this because I don't want to be responsible for this information.

00;04;24;15 - 00;04;46;12
Hark Herold
Yeah, well, and in in the classified world, a lot of things are classified because we know we are going to do that. If you didn't read it from a classified source that said, in the event of this happening, this is what we're going to do. If you just guessed, you made a logical assumption that, hey, if this happens, we're going to do this.

00;04;46;15 - 00;04;57;25
Hark Herold
That's not classified. Once you know for sure, because you've read the plans, because one of my things was, there's a plans, officer now, you can't talk about it because now it's classified. Because, you know, it's classified.

00;04;57;27 - 00;05;14;17
Craig Andrews
Yeah, yeah. It's just kind of a burden. I mean, I remember when I got out, I, I did some active mental exercises to try to actively forget the things I knew because I just didn't want to be responsible for slipping.

00;05;14;20 - 00;05;18;12
Hark Herold
Yeah. Yeah.

00;05;18;14 - 00;05;26;24
Craig Andrews
Now, the crazy thing was, I could go to the library, pull the Janes and things that if I said, am I go to jail there? Just sit there printed in jeans.

00;05;26;26 - 00;05;28;15
Hark Herold
Correct?

00;05;28;17 - 00;05;35;21
Craig Andrews
Yeah. Correct. So what were you doing? What was your role in the Air Force?

00;05;35;23 - 00;05;59;13
Hark Herold
So I couldn't keep a career field, so I switched around, which is not a normal career. Normally, you have a specialty, and you, quote unquote, grow up in that specialty, whether it's Intel or, you know, for pilots or whether it's, cyber it or whatever, you kind of stay in that career field, your, your, your career path while you're in.

00;05;59;15 - 00;06;00;25
Hark Herold
I switched I did,

00;06;00;25 - 00;06;12;21
Hark Herold
ran a 24 seven command center. Did some exec work. I did assignments, I was in calm before it was cyber. Then I was in cyber.

00;06;12;21 - 00;06;15;14
Hark Herold
My deployed command was civil engineering.

00;06;15;14 - 00;06;20;28
Hark Herold
Six and a half years at the Pentagon. So I. People are like, hey, I want to have a successful career.

00;06;20;29 - 00;06;31;03
Hark Herold
And I'm like, don't do what I did, because that's unusual to bounce around like that and be able to have a successful career. Yeah. Yeah.

00;06;31;03 - 00;06;33;05
Craig Andrews
So he did all right.

00;06;33;08 - 00;06;40;09
Hark Herold
Yeah, I did, but I wouldn't recommend that's that's not if somebody I would not recommend they go that path.

00;06;40;11 - 00;06;51;11
Craig Andrews
Yeah. Yeah. Now at one point you mentioned that you were responsible for base recovery.

00;06;51;14 - 00;06;52;08
Hark Herold
Yeah. So,

00;06;52;08 - 00;07;02;18
Hark Herold
my deployed commanders, civil engineer squadron. So for those who don't know, a civil engineer, squadrons kind of like a Department of Public Works at plumbers, carpenters, Hvac,

00;07;02;18 - 00;07;12;06
Hark Herold
heavy equipment operators. But we also have fire fighters and explosive ordnance disposal in the civil engineer squadron in the Air Force.

00;07;12;06 - 00;07;13;27
Hark Herold
And so when I was deployed

00;07;13;27 - 00;07;15;07
Hark Herold
to Iraq for,

00;07;15;07 - 00;07;22;12
Hark Herold
Operation Iraqi Freedom, you know, in oh six and, and in oh eight,

00;07;22;12 - 00;07;28;22
Hark Herold
as the civil engineer commander, we are I am accountable for getting the base up and running after a rocket attack.

00;07;28;22 - 00;07;49;00
Hark Herold
So we would have rocket attacks on the base. It would shut everything down. My job as the civil engineer squadron commander was to send out our explosive ordnance disposal folks, the firefighter folks, as necessary, and whoever else to make sure that the base was safe. And the and we were

00;07;49;00 - 00;07;53;14
Hark Herold
an F-16 base. So we had to make sure the runway was able to be used.

00;07;53;14 - 00;07;56;00
Hark Herold
It hadn't been damaged in the attack.

00;07;56;00 - 00;08;14;04
Hark Herold
And then any, any unexploded ordnance had been saved. So anyway, so yeah. So I'm accountable for for getting the base up and running, making sure my folks have everything they need so that they can make it safe and we can resume operations.

00;08;14;06 - 00;08;15;29
Craig Andrews
So in terms of the incoming,

00;08;15;29 - 00;08;19;10
Craig Andrews
how often do the bombs not go boom?

00;08;19;12 - 00;08;21;11
Hark Herold
Well, where we were,

00;08;21;11 - 00;08;23;10
Hark Herold
in in northern Iraq,

00;08;23;10 - 00;08;30;20
Hark Herold
they were using makeshift and leftover stuff. It wasn't it wasn't high quality off the shelf.

00;08;30;20 - 00;08;31;25
Hark Herold
The munitions,

00;08;31;25 - 00;08;44;13
Hark Herold
that they were shooting. It was whatever they could get. So it was not unusual for if there was a rocket attack on the base for there to it, it not to go off.

00;08;44;19 - 00;08;55;02
Hark Herold
It was it wasn't a rare occurrence. Most of the time they did, but sometimes they didn't. In which case, now you have unexploded ordnance that can go off at any time.

00;08;55;05 - 00;09;06;01
Craig Andrews
Yeah. What did you find challenging in that, in that role?

00;09;06;04 - 00;09;08;27
Hark Herold
Well, so like we had we had an occasion where,

00;09;08;27 - 00;09;27;22
Hark Herold
we had a rocket attack and it took with what felt like a really long time for my folks to do what they needed to do, because they had to go out and do a grid search to find the unexploded ordnance. That's at night, of course. Right. So it's at night.

00;09;27;24 - 00;09;36;14
Hark Herold
They're out doing a grid search because you don't just want to drive willy nilly out there where you think it landed. And so it's just a laborious, slow process.

00;09;36;14 - 00;09;44;17
Hark Herold
And all of that time, the base is shut down. And so everybody else wants to get moving and they want to resume activities.

00;09;44;17 - 00;09;52;16
Hark Herold
But our rules of engagement at the time were that everybody was locked down until we, we had a completely safe.

00;09;52;18 - 00;09;57;00
Hark Herold
And so, you know, we got the feedback that we needed to change that. So,

00;09;57;00 - 00;10;16;08
Hark Herold
get my, my EOD folks, my firefighter folks and some of the other key people on the team together and, you know, got their inputs. We brainstormed how do we reduce this time? What can we do? And so we then, you know, came up with with well, they came up with some different options and how we could do that.

00;10;16;10 - 00;10;20;02
Hark Herold
Right. So got their inputs. Let them see it.

00;10;20;02 - 00;10;27;24
Hark Herold
And then made a decision on okay, these are the steps we're going to take going forward to reduce the time that the bases is closed, basically.

00;10;27;24 - 00;10;36;11
Hark Herold
And because they were all involved in the decision making, the key people, even if we didn't do what they had wanted, they they'd seen it, they understood it.

00;10;36;12 - 00;10;42;04
Hark Herold
And so then we were able to implement these new procedures to, to get the base up and running more quickly.

00;10;42;07 - 00;10;43;27
Craig Andrews
Yeah.

00;10;43;27 - 00;10;50;12
Craig Andrews
And where what where were you? What bases were you that you had incoming like that?

00;10;50;14 - 00;10;55;13
Hark Herold
Kirkuk, Iraq, the northern Iraq?

00;10;55;15 - 00;11;02;06
Craig Andrews
Well. So when did you get out of the Air Force?

00;11;02;09 - 00;11;02;24
Hark Herold
So,

00;11;02;24 - 00;11;08;27
Hark Herold
I was able to I retired in September of 2017.

00;11;08;29 - 00;11;11;04
Craig Andrews
Oh, wow. So it's been four years.

00;11;11;07 - 00;11;30;19
Hark Herold
Yeah. So I was I was at the Pentagon and I'd been there for a while and was able to get my last assignment at the US Air Force Academy in Colorado Springs to help set up the Air Force's cyber innovation center there. So that was my last assignment. And so that's when we we came to Colorado, and that's where I've stayed.

00;11;30;21 - 00;11;37;07
Craig Andrews
Yeah. And did you jump straight into EOS after that?

00;11;37;09 - 00;11;45;11
Hark Herold
No. So when I, when I left the military, I didn't want to go work for Raytheon or Lockheed or whoever.

00;11;45;11 - 00;11;46;21
Hark Herold
Even though I had my,

00;11;46;21 - 00;11;48;15
Hark Herold
you know, my appropriate

00;11;48;15 - 00;11;56;00
Hark Herold
I was eligible for top secret CIA, and, I mean, all those things that they like. And I was coming out of a cyber AFC.

00;11;56;00 - 00;11;59;00
Hark Herold
But I didn't want to go do that.

00;11;59;02 - 00;12;07;03
Hark Herold
I had done some corporate stuff previously and wanted to work with small businesses. So I started in the Denver area,

00;12;07;03 - 00;12;11;13
Hark Herold
running an incubator for veteran and military spouse owned businesses.

00;12;11;13 - 00;12;16;16
Hark Herold
And so was, was helping to, to run that, that incubator.

00;12;16;16 - 00;12;23;14
Hark Herold
And then just got further, further and further involved with veteran and military spouses, owned businesses.

00;12;23;17 - 00;12;35;08
Craig Andrews
Yeah. Well, one of the things that you told me was you're not interested in any business outside the Denver area unless it's a veteran.

00;12;35;10 - 00;12;38;03
Hark Herold
Well, I'm interested, I'm willing to help people, but,

00;12;38;03 - 00;12;40;15
Hark Herold
from a client perspective,

00;12;40;15 - 00;12;52;11
Hark Herold
yeah. I'm at the point where I don't really want to travel a lot, and I was. I've done that previously. And so I'm looking for my client base to be pretty much along the Front Range.

00;12;52;11 - 00;12;55;00
Hark Herold
But I make exceptions for veteran,

00;12;55;00 - 00;12;57;22
Hark Herold
veteran owned or veteran affiliated businesses.

00;12;57;22 - 00;12;59;12
Hark Herold
Two of my clients

00;12;59;12 - 00;13;12;11
Hark Herold
are veterans. So one is the Pat Tillman Foundation as a client. Yep. And another one is the National Veteran Owned Business Association, which certifies businesses as being veteran owned for the private sector.

00;13;12;11 - 00;13;20;03
Hark Herold
And so those are two of my travel clients. Otherwise, I pretty much confine myself along the Front Range.

00;13;20;05 - 00;13;24;04
Craig Andrews
Well, I think it just struck me that obviously you have a lot of,

00;13;24;04 - 00;13;29;15
Craig Andrews
kinship and affection for veterans, that that would be your one exception.

00;13;29;17 - 00;13;46;11
Hark Herold
Yeah. And and so that's what I'm willing to do. But if you have listeners who are not in, you know, that area. What I do as an iOS implementer, and we'll talk a little bit that there is we're there's 800 around the globe. So,

00;13;46;11 - 00;13;53;21
Hark Herold
if you're interested in what we talk about when we talk about that aspect, I can connect you with local resources.

00;13;53;23 - 00;13;58;17
Craig Andrews
Yeah. And so how did you when did you eventually get involved in iOS?

00;13;58;19 - 00;13;59;12
Hark Herold
Yeah. So,

00;13;59;12 - 00;14;02;08
Hark Herold
so I was I was volunteering, running that,

00;14;02;08 - 00;14;09;05
Hark Herold
incubator for veteran military spouses on businesses, a national nonprofit called Bunker Labs.

00;14;09;05 - 00;14;11;28
Hark Herold
Was doing other things, helping,

00;14;11;28 - 00;14;18;08
Hark Herold
veteran military spouses, owned businesses. And so they knew what we were doing in Denver.

00;14;18;08 - 00;14;23;06
Hark Herold
They came in and said, hey, we want to replicate this in other cities.

00;14;23;08 - 00;14;25;28
Hark Herold
To make this somewhat long story a little bit shorter.

00;14;25;28 - 00;14;26;17
Hark Herold
So,

00;14;26;17 - 00;14;30;26
Hark Herold
they ended up in getting me because I was already doing it here in Denver.

00;14;30;26 - 00;14;34;06
Hark Herold
And then I ended up being recruited to join the staff,

00;14;34;06 - 00;14;42;21
Hark Herold
and ended up as the president and CEO for for Bunker Labs, the national organization. Bunker was running on iOS.

00;14;42;23 - 00;14;51;13
Hark Herold
So that was my introduction to iOS was I joined an organization that was already using that system to operate.

00;14;51;16 - 00;14;53;13
Craig Andrews
What is iOS?

00;14;53;15 - 00;15;17;12
Hark Herold
Yeah. So iOS, the it's the entrepreneurial operating system. So it's a it's a way to operate your business. It's not a computer system. Every business has an operating system. It's just the way you operate. It's the way you talk about your vision and decide on your strategic planning. It's the way you get. Make sure you have the right people and how you treat people and work with people.

00;15;17;15 - 00;15;39;04
Hark Herold
It's it's how you treat data. It's how you resolve your issues. It's about your processes and then how you execute. Everybody has and if they have a business, they have a way. They do those things. They probably are hodgepodge. And they're doing a little bit of this and a little bit of that, and they like this. And they came in and so, so it's it's it's not a

00;15;39;04 - 00;15;42;21
Hark Herold
system that's reinforcing that works within itself.

00;15;42;21 - 00;15;46;25
Hark Herold
And they probably don't even have a name for it. It's just how we do stuff.

00;15;46;25 - 00;15;47;25
Hark Herold
And so,

00;15;47;25 - 00;15;53;26
Hark Herold
you know, Whitman, who created who wrote the book traction and created the iOS system,

00;15;53;26 - 00;16;04;26
Hark Herold
took these different bits and pieces, put them together into a holistic system that is reinforcing the different components, work together. And so that's what iOS is.

00;16;04;26 - 00;16;09;23
Hark Herold
It's a way to run your business.

00;16;09;25 - 00;16;13;27
Craig Andrews
What's that look like? You know, so if I'm a business owner,

00;16;13;27 - 00;16;20;21
Craig Andrews
I mean, it sounds interesting, but what was it look like when for me to use iOS?

00;16;20;23 - 00;16;21;13
Hark Herold
So,

00;16;24;15 - 00;16;29;00
Hark Herold
So when I work with the leadership team to help them implement iOS. Okay.

00;16;29;00 - 00;16;37;14
Hark Herold
It's designed to do three things for, for the company. Number one is to get the leadership team aligned.

00;16;37;14 - 00;16;47;05
Hark Herold
Three, three things we call vision, traction and helping. Vision is about getting the leadership team aligned on where they're going and how they're going to get there.

00;16;47;07 - 00;17;15;06
Hark Herold
Traction is about putting systems and processes in place to execute against all aspects of that vision. And healthy is about making the leadership team a more functioning, cohesive team. Because sometimes leaders are not good team members. Then ultimately, as goes the leadership team, so goes to the rest of the organization. So we get everybody in the organization aligned on the vision.

00;17;15;08 - 00;17;30;02
Hark Herold
We put those systems and processes in place. So wherever they go throughout the organization, people are executing with discipline and accountability against that vision. They're gaining traction and advancing as a functioning, cohesive team.

00;17;30;04 - 00;17;38;06
Craig Andrews
Yeah. You know, I wonder how many people.

00;17;38;09 - 00;17;50;26
Craig Andrews
When you when you're talking to people, how many times do you run in where somebody is like, no, I should be able to figure this out on my own or, you know, and it's not necessarily ego driven, but.

00;17;50;28 - 00;17;52;15
Hark Herold
It's pretty much ego driven.

00;17;52;17 - 00;17;53;19
Craig Andrews
It is.

00;17;53;22 - 00;18;00;04
Hark Herold
Yeah. I mean, it's everything's in this book traction. I mean, it's in this book.

00;18;00;04 - 00;18;05;02
Hark Herold
And so if you're interested, go out and read the damn book. It's not,

00;18;05;02 - 00;18;20;07
Hark Herold
you know, magic pills. The challenge is reading the book is like, is like having the gym, right? It's there. Just go use it. Go work out. Okay. Nothing wrong with that.

00;18;20;08 - 00;18;42;23
Hark Herold
That's better than doing nothing but. Do you want to coach to help you? Do you want a personal trainer? That's where I come in. I'm like that. That coach or that personal trainer at the gym. Or you can use, like a sports team analogy, right? If you have two teams that are that are, that are playing in the World Series, one has a coach, one doesn't have a coach.

00;18;42;26 - 00;18;59;02
Hark Herold
Which one do you want a better. Yeah. So so it's we call it self implementing. If you read the book and you do it yourself, self implementing is better than nothing. And that's typically really good for the smaller companies.

00;18;59;02 - 00;19;09;25
Hark Herold
But when you get to a point where you realize there's a lot more that you could get from the system, you just don't know how to really get it implemented.

00;19;09;27 - 00;19;20;10
Hark Herold
And then a lot of times, entrepreneurs honestly don't have the discipline to to really do it. They need somebody to hold them accountable.

00;19;20;10 - 00;19;30;06
Hark Herold
So it's not just holding their team accountable, it's holding that that owner or that visionary, that founder accountable. And they just need that. And that's when it really takes off.

00;19;30;08 - 00;19;42;03
Craig Andrews
You know. Well, when you talk about coaches, you know, why am I saying I told people, I said, you know, Michael Jordan didn't have a single coach. He had a team of coaches.

00;19;42;05 - 00;19;43;19
Hark Herold
Yeah.

00;19;43;21 - 00;19;56;26
Craig Andrews
Yeah. So if somebody with the talent and Michael Jordan seems a value and multiple coaches, it shouldn't be a threat to anybody to have a coach come in for their business.

00;19;56;29 - 00;20;21;24
Hark Herold
Exactly. It's all about somebody who this is. This is what I do. I'm a professional in being an iOS implementer. An iOS coach. That's what I do. I'm not distracted by other things. I'm not also trying to run this other business. I'm not like, this is what I do. I'm a dedicated coach working with the leadership team of,

00;20;21;24 - 00;20;27;09
Hark Herold
small to medium sized businesses to help them succeed.

00;20;27;12 - 00;20;36;23
Hark Herold
It's not about me. I don't I don't care if you're an Hvac company, a construction company. If you do stuff in space,

00;20;36;23 - 00;20;43;06
Hark Herold
whatever you do, I want to help you get what you want out of the business.

00;20;43;08 - 00;20;52;12
Craig Andrews
Well, you know, I'll be going to something called Camp Gladiator this evening, which is kind of an outdoor, high intensity workout. And,

00;20;52;12 - 00;21;09;02
Craig Andrews
and some amazing, you know, I've, I've trained with a series of different coaches. And the coach I'll be training with this evening. You know, really has been transformative. And it's come back to what you're saying.

00;21;09;04 - 00;21;10;14
Craig Andrews
It's I mean, I show up with,

00;21;10;14 - 00;21;19;28
Craig Andrews
a couple of hand weights in a workout mat, and, you know, we do different things and we go for a run. I can do 100% of those things in my cul de sac right here.

00;21;20;01 - 00;21;21;28
Hark Herold
Right?

00;21;22;00 - 00;21;33;00
Craig Andrews
But my wife says I'm in the best shape she's ever seen me and am doing that, by the way, with a with a screwed up lung from Covid.

00;21;33;02 - 00;21;44;10
Hark Herold
Yeah. Well, and we talk about the coach. Right. And you talked about different coaches that you've had. It's in iOS. There's like I said there's 800 implementers around the globe okay.

00;21;44;10 - 00;21;59;02
Hark Herold
And the implementer needs to click with the the leadership team, especially the founder or the visionary as we call it. But they've got to click. And sometimes the system is the right system.

00;21;59;05 - 00;22;23;10
Hark Herold
But they, they they need to find the right coach. Yeah. Right. Because there's different personalities. There's different. We all do the same thing. It's like different personal trainers. Right. Like they all are doing. But it's it's different how they do it, what they do, how they emphasize what they've seen. So so yeah. So it's like that in the iOS world too is.

00;22;23;10 - 00;22;25;10
Hark Herold
And that's why it's like,

00;22;25;10 - 00;22;27;03
Hark Herold
we have an abundance mindset,

00;22;27;03 - 00;22;37;07
Hark Herold
amongst the, the people who do this. It's like, listen, if, if, if iOS is right for you and I'm not right for you, I know somebody who can help.

00;22;37;09 - 00;22;48;14
Craig Andrews
Yeah. So one of the things, one of the things I've heard in iOS is right. See it on the bus. Right. Bus. Did I get that right?

00;22;48;16 - 00;23;10;16
Hark Herold
Yeah. Yeah. So so we we do various exercises right through as we go along the journey. But one of the first things we do is, is establish what is the vision for the organization. We do that with the leadership team. Know where where are we going and how are we going to get there so that we help the leadership team to figure that out.

00;23;10;18 - 00;23;32;08
Hark Herold
And we liken that to that's like the placard on the front of the bus that says, this is where we're going. Whatever comes in that this is where we're going. If you want to go where we're going, hop about, but we're not an Uber. If you want to go over here, don't, don't, don't get on this bus because this is where we're going.

00;23;32;11 - 00;23;51;19
Hark Herold
And then we get to the Jim Collins aspect of, you know, from, from good to great of right people in the right seats on that bus. So first we define where the bus is going, where the organization is going. Then we work to get the right people on the bus and then make sure they're in the right seats to help drive the organization to the next level.

00;23;51;22 - 00;23;54;26
Craig Andrews
You know.

00;23;54;28 - 00;23;55;21
Craig Andrews
What

00;23;55;21 - 00;24;00;21
Craig Andrews
what barriers DC from that keep people from achieving.

00;24;00;21 - 00;24;05;08
Craig Andrews
Folks are on the right bus and they're in the right seat on the bus.

00;24;05;11 - 00;24;06;11
Hark Herold
Yeah. So,

00;24;06;11 - 00;24;14;25
Hark Herold
some of it is because we work with growing organizations. And so some of it is. Hey, listen, we've had, Jim,

00;24;14;25 - 00;24;28;28
Hark Herold
has been with the organization. He started out doing our books and and then he moved up in the organization, and now he's the chief financial officer, but he's really not a chief financial officer.

00;24;29;01 - 00;24;57;05
Hark Herold
He he's not there. He doesn't bring what he doesn't bring what the organization needs to get to the next level. And people are justifiably that they love him. But it's it's hard to sometimes what's the best for the organization overall. So sometimes you got to make hard decisions on what's but what's right for the other 42 people in the organization.

00;24;57;08 - 00;24;58;12
Hark Herold
Right.

00;24;58;12 - 00;25;06;02
Hark Herold
So so holding on make delaying and making people decisions is, is one of the things that holds people back?

00;25;06;04 - 00;25;17;04
Craig Andrews
Yeah. Well, I know for me, in my career, there was one time I held on to somebody way too long. And the biggest indication was when I,

00;25;17;04 - 00;25;20;17
Craig Andrews
when fired him, his colleagues came up to me and thanked me.

00;25;20;19 - 00;25;44;23
Hark Herold
Yes, we we call it that. The 36 hours of pain is the. It's hard and it should be hard. You dealing with people and making those kinds of decisions with people should not be done like it's hard, but that 36 hours of pain then gets you past that. And to your point, everybody else, all the other team members go, what took you so long?

00;25;44;26 - 00;25;48;15
Craig Andrews
Yep, yep.

00;25;48;15 - 00;26;08;23
Craig Andrews
Let's switch as let's switch and talk about that. You told me something. You said there's a lot of resources for vets. And I'll be honest, I. I mean, obviously I'm a vet and spent six years in the Marines and I if there resources. I don't know about it. I feel like I'm going to learn.

00;26;08;25 - 00;26;11;21
Hark Herold
Yes. And that's the challenge right.

00;26;11;21 - 00;26;18;18
Hark Herold
So the resources are there, but it doesn't do any good if people don't know them. And so,

00;26;18;18 - 00;26;20;24
Hark Herold
one of the things that that I do,

00;26;20;24 - 00;26;30;18
Hark Herold
and I can share a list with you is, is I've compiled over the years just different resource is and again, the veterans I work with are I'm specifically talking about,

00;26;30;18 - 00;26;31;13
Hark Herold
business owners.

00;26;31;20 - 00;26;44;12
Hark Herold
So it's for entrepreneurs and business owners. There's other organizations that have lots of resources for veterans who are different, have a different things they're dealing with. Right. I'm talking about for business owners. So,

00;26;44;12 - 00;26;48;00
Hark Herold
there's organizations such as Patriot Boot Camp,

00;26;48;00 - 00;26;56;04
Hark Herold
which is now affiliated with the Disabled American Veterans. And they run like a, like a two day boot camp for,

00;26;56;04 - 00;26;59;23
Hark Herold
veterans who own businesses, small veterans, small businesses.

00;26;59;23 - 00;27;01;25
Hark Herold
Right. Like, they're just kind of starting,

00;27;01;25 - 00;27;09;18
Hark Herold
and they do expose and all sorts of resources. The national veteran Owned Business association that I mentioned earlier.

00;27;09;18 - 00;27;15;22
Hark Herold
If you have physical products, they certify these, businesses as being veteran owned and then have a

00;27;15;22 - 00;27;24;29
Hark Herold
marketplace where they connect them to, like fortune 500 companies who are looking for veteran owned businesses in their supply chain.

00;27;25;01 - 00;27;25;20
Hark Herold
There is,

00;27;25;20 - 00;27;26;23
Hark Herold
Bunker Labs,

00;27;26;23 - 00;27;56;17
Hark Herold
which I was affiliated with, which is now with the Institute of Veteran Military Families out of Syracuse. They have programing wherever people are on their entrepreneurial journey, whether it's there on the ideation stage, like I'm thinking about it, they have an MVP or a minimum viable product. Or if they're multi-million dollar businesses, there's we have different programing at different levels, all designed at at like no cost to help veteran and military families, business owners.

00;27;56;19 - 00;27;59;15
Hark Herold
So and those are just the ones I've talked my head

00;27;59;15 - 00;28;02;26
Hark Herold
but but there are a lot of them out there.

00;28;02;28 - 00;28;06;25
Craig Andrews
Wow. Well, this has been awesome.

00;28;06;25 - 00;28;09;08
Craig Andrews
Mark, if somebody wanted to reach you.

00;28;09;08 - 00;28;15;27
Craig Andrews
And if somebody want to figure out where to get these veteran resources, how do they reach you?

00;28;16;00 - 00;28;16;22
Hark Herold
Yeah. So,

00;28;16;22 - 00;28;22;14
Hark Herold
so you can go to my website. Is is probably the easiest to start with. It's haq iOS

00;28;22;14 - 00;28;26;28
Hark Herold
a r k e o s.com.

00;28;26;28 - 00;28;28;18
Hark Herold
That'll get you to my web page. And,

00;28;28;18 - 00;28;36;10
Hark Herold
there's all my contact information. That's probably the easiest and fastest and most efficient way to to connect.

00;28;36;12 - 00;28;40;18
Craig Andrews
It's awesome. Well, thanks for sharing that on leaders and legacies.

00;28;40;20 - 00;28;45;11
Hark Herold
Hey, I appreciate the opportunity. Great. Good talking with you.

00;28;45;11 - 00;29;12;07
Craig Andrews
This is Craig Andrews. I want to thank you for listening to the Leaders and Legacies podcast. We're looking for leaders to share how they're making the impact beyond themselves. If that's you, please go to Ally's for me.com/guest and sign up there. If you got something out of this interview, we would love you to share this

00;29;12;07 - 00;29;14;02
Craig Andrews
episode on social media.

00;29;14;04 - 00;29;37;14
Craig Andrews
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00;29;37;16 - 00;29;45;21
Craig Andrews
Please go ahead and subscribe. Your thumbs up. Ratings and reviews go a long way to help promote the show. It means a lot to me.

00;29;45;21 - 00;31;47;24
Craig Andrews
It means a lot to my team. If you want to know more, please go to Ally's for me.com. Or follow me on LinkedIn. Thanks for listening. We'll see you next time.