Courtney DeRonde is the CEO of Forge Financial and Management Consulting and creator of the Simple Scale Up System, a framework built to help already-successful businesses navigate the complexity that growth creates. A CPA by training and an operator shaped by hard leadership lessons, she now helps founders and leadership teams scale both the business and the leader behind it.
In this episode, Courtney shares what happens when growth creates a level of complexity that old habits can no longer handle. She walks through a painful leadership failure that nearly pushed her out of the business, the 18-month process she used to rebuild trust with her partners, and the human-centered philosophy that now drives her consulting work. Courtney also explains why scaling requires transformation in both the company and the leader, why strategic work needs dedicated space instead of leftovers, and how her Planning to Scale process helps leaders narrow focus and clear a path to growth.
Want to learn more about Courtney DeRonde's work? Check out her website at https://planningtoscalebook.com.
Connect with Courtney DeRonde on LinkedIn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/courtneyderonde/.
Key Points & Timestamps
- 00:00:51 - Courtney DeRonde introduced: CEO of Forge Financial and Management Consulting, creator of the Simple Scale Up System, and author of Planning to Scale.
- 00:02:16 - Courtney explains that she works with already-successful businesses that hit a ceiling when growth creates new complexity and old methods stop working.
- 00:02:43 - She says scale-up requires two transformations at once: the leader has to grow and the organization has to grow with them.
- 00:07:23 - Courtney shares a major leadership mistake from 2020, when she proposed splitting her firm before fully understanding how the move would affect her partners.
- 00:09:17 - She describes the long trust-rebuild process: listening without defending herself, using tools like the Enneagram and CliftonStrengths, and learning how each partner saw the future.
- 00:13:27 - Eighteen months later, she brought back two options, stay together or split, and the group unanimously chose the strategy that had once triggered the conflict.
- 00:15:35 - Courtney explains why high-performing leaders still need coaching, saying success does not remove the need for outside perspective and accountability.
- 00:17:45 - One of her clearest lessons: when people feel heard and understood, barriers come down and real progress becomes possible.
- 00:20:48 - Courtney lays out Forge's core philosophy: they do not just work with numbers, they work with people, because every financial decision sits inside a human story.
- 00:23:40 - She breaks down Forge's model, combining financial services with management consulting and a structured scaling process for leadership teams.
- 00:27:39 - Courtney argues that leaders get more strategic work done in two focused in-person days than in weeks of fragmented office time.
- 00:31:39 - She says one of the hidden benefits of her workshops is helping successful owners realize they are not alone in the complexity and pressure that growth creates.
- 00:32:40 - How to reach Courtney: connect with her on LinkedIn and visit planningtoscalebook.com to learn about the book and access the tools tied to her scaling process.
Transcript
[00:00:05 - 00:00:30]
Craig Andrews
I was in a coma for six weeks while the doctors told my wife I was going to die. When I woke up, she told me the most fantastic story. My team kept running the business without me. Freelancers reached out to my team and said, we will do whatever it takes. As long as Craig's in the hospital. I consider that the greatest accomplishment in my career.
[00:00:30 - 00:00:51]
Craig Andrews
My name is Craig Andrews and this is the Leaders and Legacies podcast where we talk to leaders creating an impact beyond themselves. At the end of today's interview, I'll tell you how you can be the next leader featured on this show.
[00:00:51 - 00:01:21]
Craig Andrews
Today I will welcome Courtney DeRonde. She is the CEO of Forge Financial and Management Consulting. She's also the creator of the Simple Scale Up System. She helps businesses and nonprofit leaders use proven systems to take charge of their personal and organizational development, so they can fulfill their purpose and lead their organizations to do the same. Courtney is an author, and her book is coming out June 1st.
[00:01:21 - 00:01:32]
Craig Andrews
Make sure you check this out. It's called Planning to Scale. An annual process to narrow your focus and clear your company's path to growth. Courtney, welcome.
[00:01:32 - 00:01:34]
Courtney DeRonde
Hey, Craig. Thanks so much for having me.
[00:01:34 - 00:01:38]
Craig Andrews
I've been looking forward to this since,
[00:01:38 - 00:01:40]
Craig Andrews
I just, you know, I,
[00:01:40 - 00:01:49]
Craig Andrews
so my, my team reviews all the pitches and everybody I get pitched daily. You know, people wanting to come on the podcast and, like, you talk in the wrong person. But,
[00:01:49 - 00:01:53]
Craig Andrews
when they brief me on what you do and I looked over at, I was really excited.
[00:01:53 - 00:02:16]
Craig Andrews
I was like, I'm looking. Been looking forward to this conversation. You know, and I think if I understand correctly, one of the problems that you solve is business is scaling. You know, in so many businesses, they reach a certain point and then things get all jammed up and then they struggle. You help them fix that.
[00:02:16 - 00:02:43]
Courtney DeRonde
We do. We work with businesses that are already established and successful, and the success and the growth they've had, it creates new complexity and they often get stuck because it's like they've reached a new level and they have more they want to do, but the things that they did to get to where they are don't seem to be working anymore.
[00:02:43 - 00:02:57]
Courtney DeRonde
And so what we do is help the leader scale themselves and the organization. There are two transformations that have to happen. The leader and the business.
[00:02:57 - 00:03:02]
Craig Andrews
Well, one of the things I heard you say and that as you help businesses, they are already successful.
[00:03:02 - 00:03:03]
Courtney DeRonde
Yes.
[00:03:03 - 00:03:24]
Craig Andrews
You know what one of my sobering realizations years ago was? I'm not a I'm not a new product guy. I'm not Steve Jobs. I'm not good. I can't help people. You know, people come to me, hey, can you help me prove out this idea and get launched? And I had to realize that's not my skill set as I.
[00:03:24 - 00:03:41]
Craig Andrews
Similarly, if you have a if you have something that, you know, a proven business, that you've proven that people and by what you have, I can help you get to the next level, but I can't. Don't come to me with some idea, I can't. I'm just not good at figuring out. Is this the right thing?
[00:03:41 - 00:03:51]
Courtney DeRonde
Yeah. Yeah. I think, you know, startup and scale up are completely different. They are different challenges, different things that you focus on. And,
[00:03:51 - 00:04:09]
Courtney DeRonde
the things that you have to focus on in the scale up phase, when you're already established, you're already successful, you have your product. You have your customers. What's happening now is that you have more and more customers, and you have more and more employees, and those create new challenges.
[00:04:09 - 00:04:41]
Courtney DeRonde
And sometimes it can be disorienting for leaders and business owners because they've worked so hard to grow and create the success. And then they get it and it feels heavy. It feels disorienting. And I, I come across so many people. I've been there myself where you think maybe this isn't worth it. Maybe I should just quit and give up because it feels so heavy, because a lot of times the leaders, the owners are,
[00:04:41 - 00:04:44]
Courtney DeRonde
you know, at the center of everything.
[00:04:44 - 00:04:46]
Courtney DeRonde
And there's so much,
[00:04:46 - 00:05:04]
Courtney DeRonde
pressure to, to succeed. But also a lot of times there's so much hope and vision around what's possible that people have more they want to do and when it's already very heavy, that can feel, you know, challenging and people get stuck and,
[00:05:04 - 00:05:08]
Courtney DeRonde
they kind of plateau or hit a ceiling when there's more that they want to do.
[00:05:08 - 00:05:30]
Courtney DeRonde
That's who we work with. So we're really not, you know, focus on the startup phase. Some of our clients, we're working directly with a founder who's been at it for a few years. Sometimes we're working with the second or third generation business owner, and there's a lot of legacy there, whether it's family or professional services that just passed from, you know, one generation to the other.
[00:05:30 - 00:05:38]
Courtney DeRonde
But the commonality is that they've already achieved success and growth. They're trying to get to the next level.
[00:05:38 - 00:05:39]
Craig Andrews
Well,
[00:05:39 - 00:05:52]
Craig Andrews
and it has to be enormously comforting. You know, to when they're in that place to have somebody come along and just say, hey, you know what? We can get through this. You know, we know the path through.
[00:05:52 - 00:05:55]
Courtney DeRonde
Yes. Yeah, we I always feel like,
[00:05:55 - 00:05:57]
Courtney DeRonde
people need,
[00:05:58 - 00:06:11]
Courtney DeRonde
a belief that it can be better, right? The better is possible. Doesn't have to be this way. They need to be able to believe that. But, man, it sure helps if you've got a map and a guide to help you along the way. And that's typically what we do.
[00:06:11 - 00:06:15]
Courtney DeRonde
We you know, the guide portion is myself, my co facilitator.
[00:06:16 - 00:06:20]
Courtney DeRonde
Our team, you know, we're guiding people. We've been there.
[00:06:20 - 00:06:25]
Courtney DeRonde
The things that we help people with are the things that I've experienced in my own journey. And then,
[00:06:26 - 00:06:37]
Courtney DeRonde
you know, I would say formalized into ways that I can teach and equip other leaders, but it's they I don't teach anything I haven't done myself and experienced myself.
[00:06:37 - 00:06:41]
Courtney DeRonde
And the map is really all the tools and the processes that we equip people with.
[00:06:41 - 00:06:56]
Courtney DeRonde
So it's it's not theory. It's, you know, real lived experience converted into very practical tools that people can apply in their own leadership and in their own businesses.
[00:06:56 - 00:07:13]
Craig Andrews
Yeah. Well, and you mentioned something, the green room, you know, about your your personal growth path. You had this great idea. You presented this great idea and there was not applause, cheers and adulation for your great idea.
[00:07:13 - 00:07:23]
Courtney DeRonde
Yes. Yeah. So I, I became the managing partner and CEO of a firm called TD. It was the firm I joined out of college, and,
[00:07:23 - 00:07:37]
Courtney DeRonde
I was appointed the next managing partner. After many years there. And one of the very first things I did was propose a vision and a strategy to my fellow partners that we split the firm.
[00:07:37 - 00:07:38]
Courtney DeRonde
So,
[00:07:38 - 00:08:02]
Courtney DeRonde
you know, financially, it made sense. Strategically it made sense. I prepared all of this. I had a couple of executive team members who were totally on board with me, and I will never forget, I mean, it was in 2020, so it was all video. You know, we were, during Covid, we were all on video and I shared this and I could just see people staring back at me like, what are you talking about?
[00:08:03 - 00:08:08]
Courtney DeRonde
Like, we they were hurt. They were blindsided.
[00:08:08 - 00:08:21]
Courtney DeRonde
They were not thinking about the strategic or financial implications about this. They were shocked and dismayed from a more relational perspective. It it felt like,
[00:08:21 - 00:08:34]
Courtney DeRonde
I was just saying, you know, we don't need you anymore. We don't want to be in this together. And it was because I hadn't considered their personalities, the human side of it.
[00:08:34 - 00:08:59]
Courtney DeRonde
I was thinking so analytically, you know, we'll make more money, you'll make more money. Our clients will all be happy. It'll be so much easier, because what had happened is we lead essentially through our growth, ended up with two very different business models within the firm. And so it just made sense. We should just, you know, carve out these two business models and quit trying to do two very different things altogether.
[00:09:00 - 00:09:10]
Courtney DeRonde
That was oh my goodness, just such a big failure right out of the shoe. And I, I thought I should quit. It felt very heavy.
[00:09:10 - 00:09:17]
Courtney DeRonde
And I definitely thought, I can't recover from this mistake.
[00:09:17 - 00:09:27]
Craig Andrews
Yeah. I mean, that's the emotions. You know, I'm just thinking through some of the emotions, listening to what you say. That's a lot to process. And,
[00:09:27 - 00:09:36]
Craig Andrews
I would imagine a lot of lost trust in an instant. And took. So let's, let's show here. How do you rebuild the trust.
[00:09:36 - 00:09:47]
Courtney DeRonde
Yeah. Well, you're exactly right. The trust was lost. I mean, a lot of these, these partners I had, I'd been business partners with for probably a decade. I'd work with them for a couple of decades, almost.
[00:09:47 - 00:09:54]
Courtney DeRonde
And the trust was just instantly gone. And so the first thing I did was,
[00:09:54 - 00:09:58]
Courtney DeRonde
Well, first was I had to intentionally decide that I'm not giving up.
[00:09:58 - 00:10:19]
Courtney DeRonde
I had to recognize that I had made a mistake and it was not fatal. And that and this was I had an executive coach at the time who helped me see this mistake was so big that I had an opportunity to learn more lessons from it than most people learn in a decade of leadership. So it shifted my perspective.
[00:10:19 - 00:10:47]
Courtney DeRonde
Okay, look at how much you can learn so quickly. And I just had to believe that. I had to think, okay, I can learn from this. And so one of the very first things I did after making that decision that I'm not giving up, I'm not quitting, I'm learning. I started building trust with my partners again. I scheduled regular one on ones with them, I listened, I didn't try to explain myself.
[00:10:47 - 00:10:53]
Courtney DeRonde
I tried to learn what their perspective was. I tried to learn what their goals were.
[00:10:53 - 00:10:54]
Courtney DeRonde
We used,
[00:10:54 - 00:11:13]
Courtney DeRonde
the Enneagram, we use Colby, we use Cliftonstrengths to learn more about each other and our wiring. And I just became a student of who these people are, and I because that was the biggest thing I was missing. I was not thinking about them as real human people with emotions tied into this.
[00:11:13 - 00:11:44]
Courtney DeRonde
I was just thinking about the logistical, financial, strategic side of this. So I did not gain alignment. And that's what's necessary. You can have the best strategies, the best ideas, but if you can't align other people around them, it won't matter. So I built trust by listening, understanding. And then I would say the third thing I did was I gave up my desire to control the outcome.
[00:11:44 - 00:12:17]
Courtney DeRonde
When I went into that, that meeting, that zoom call, I was so confident that this was the answer. And ultimately I had to decide. I'm I'm not confident that is the answer. I am confident that I want to be a leader who listens, who aligns. And whatever outcome that leads to, I'm going to accept it. If I can look back and say, I led well through this, that will be a win.
[00:12:17 - 00:12:30]
Courtney DeRonde
It's not a matter of whether or not we ever split or not. So I just gave up my hold on controlling the outcome, and it made all the difference in the world.
[00:12:30 - 00:12:32]
Craig Andrews
You know, one thing I noticed during Covid,
[00:12:32 - 00:12:49]
Craig Andrews
you know, I live in Texas and by year by year into the pandemic, I noticed people at the grocery store would park literally right in front of the front door where the road is, and they would, like, wait for their family to come out of the store and they'd load up groceries.
[00:12:49 - 00:12:56]
Craig Andrews
And it's shocked me because it was rude behavior. And here in Texas, folks are heavily armed. You know, we're usually more polite,
[00:12:57 - 00:13:01]
Craig Andrews
and we don't do things like that. And it irritated me.
[00:13:01 - 00:13:10]
Craig Andrews
But once I got over being irritated, I was like, okay, why is this happening? And I realized for the last year, people have lost control.
[00:13:10 - 00:13:13]
Craig Andrews
They've lost a sense of autonomy.
[00:13:13 - 00:13:23]
Craig Andrews
And they're just acting out. And sure enough, as soon as the pandemic, you know, as soon as lockdowns lifted, that quit happening.
[00:13:23 - 00:13:30]
Craig Andrews
It's amazing how how badly people can respond when you try to take control of their decisions.
[00:13:30 - 00:13:41]
Courtney DeRonde
Yes. Right. Yeah. And I think I think people, you know, one of the main things was that that was hurtful for me in the situation was that people misinterpreted my intent.
[00:13:41 - 00:13:42]
Craig Andrews
Yeah.
[00:13:42 - 00:13:57]
Courtney DeRonde
And but I was like, you know, rightfully so. I didn't I didn't do the work to communicate and align the way I should. That was just such a gift for me to be able to learn that at that point and was able to rebuild trust.
[00:13:57 - 00:14:00]
Courtney DeRonde
About 18 months later,
[00:14:01 - 00:14:09]
Courtney DeRonde
I came to them with two visions, one where we move forward together and one where we split.
[00:14:09 - 00:14:12]
Craig Andrews
You gave them control. You gave them their autonomy back.
[00:14:12 - 00:14:33]
Courtney DeRonde
I yes, and I genuinely was completely fine with either one. I didn't I was I was not tied to we have to split. I had I worked at two different visions with two different strategies and I was fine with either one. And the vote was unanimous to split.
[00:14:33 - 00:14:33]
Craig Andrews
Wow.
[00:14:34 - 00:15:01]
Courtney DeRonde
Because it was the right strategy, it was the right vision. But I had not approached the alignment properly. And if you don't have alignment, there's no way you can follow through and implement your plans. Following through and implementing your plans is hard enough when you are aligned, but if you don't have alignment, there's just there's no way. You know, we I met first that first time we didn't even get to a vote.
[00:15:01 - 00:15:09]
Courtney DeRonde
We didn't even call for a vote. It was so clear that this was not going to fly. But then there we were. And so yeah, within
[00:15:09 - 00:15:22]
Courtney DeRonde
within two years, we were actually split. So when we did that vote 18 months later and about six, seven months later and the, the, you know, all the agreements were signed and we split and
[00:15:22 - 00:15:27]
Courtney DeRonde
and because it was the right vision, it was the right strategy ultimately for us.
[00:15:27 - 00:15:35]
Courtney DeRonde
And we had just finally aligned around it. But that was that has shaped my leadership and perspective. So much,
[00:15:35 - 00:15:37]
Courtney DeRonde
that it really was a gift. I'm so grateful that
[00:15:37 - 00:15:43]
Courtney DeRonde
I had a coach who could help shift my perspective in that moment, because it would have been easy to give up.
[00:15:43 - 00:15:46]
Craig Andrews
What a valuable person in your life at the right time.
[00:15:46 - 00:15:48]
Courtney DeRonde
Absolutely.
[00:15:48 - 00:15:55]
Craig Andrews
You know what? Why am I saying so? I told people, I said, you know, Michael Jordan didn't have a single coach. He had a team of coaches.
[00:15:55 - 00:15:57]
Courtney DeRonde
Yeah.
[00:15:57 - 00:16:15]
Craig Andrews
You know, one of the most naturally gifted athletes of our lifetime knew he couldn't do it alone. He needed a coach. He needed a team of coaches in his life. And because of that team, he was you know he will forever be legendary. And what he did in his craft.
[00:16:15 - 00:16:39]
Courtney DeRonde
Yes. Absolutely. Yeah I think that's a great point. It can be easy to think that people who are successful, they're just born that way or they just work hard, they do it. And I think the people that have the most success are those who are leaning on other guides, other coaches, people who have been there before, people who have different perspectives, who can help you to grow as well.
[00:16:39 - 00:16:56]
Courtney DeRonde
And so I think that's just such a valuable lesson. And it's, you know, we have we do group coaching. So we have a group coaching program called scaling Leader. But we encourage all of our clients to have a one on one coach as well. We have we have affiliate coaches that do that kind of work where they do one on one night group.
[00:16:57 - 00:17:17]
Courtney DeRonde
We do group coaching and we affiliate with them because group coaching is valuable. You get the community, that connection. We've we've got a curriculum that's driving it. And then they leverage one on one coaching in between our quarterly sessions to help them in the more granular day to day stuff with their with their coach implementing what they've learned.
[00:17:17 - 00:17:31]
Courtney DeRonde
And so coaching I have received so much value in my career from coaches, and we encourage our clients to take that perspective of as well.
[00:17:31 - 00:17:45]
Craig Andrews
Absolutely. And there's one thing I don't I want to make sure we don't miss. One of the elements that you said, one of the key elements in rebuilding that trust was listening. I think we should never underestimate the power of listening.
[00:17:45 - 00:17:54]
Craig Andrews
It's when people feel heard and understood. It drops so many barriers to whatever's next.
[00:17:54 - 00:18:19]
Courtney DeRonde
Absolutely. And I learned I learned so much by listening. And and it wasn't always things that I agreed with, but at least I understood where they were coming from. And it helped shape the way I worked towards alignment, whether it was together or separate. You know, it just it's shaped so much.
[00:18:19 - 00:18:35]
Craig Andrews
Well, there's a solid I'm pretty sure is from Iowa is named Chris Voss. He wrote a book, Never Split the Difference. Yeah, it's kind of like a a masterpiece. On the art of persuasive listening. And
[00:18:35 - 00:18:41]
Craig Andrews
but yeah, he is is it, you know, the subtitle of the book is How to Negotiate as if your life depends on it.
[00:18:41 - 00:19:04]
Craig Andrews
Yeah. He, he was an FBI hostage negotiator. And he said that. Yeah. He makes jokes on stage. He's a funny guy. But he talks about how you know what anything that we're applying in this book you can apply in the home. And it's it's not manipulative. It's not manipulative when you are truly trying to understand where somebody is coming from.
[00:19:05 - 00:19:10]
Courtney DeRonde
Yes, yes, I agree. And one of the main tools that helped me with this was
[00:19:10 - 00:19:32]
Courtney DeRonde
the Colby, the and the Enneagram. I mentioned those those assessments that help understand how people think, feel, take action not to manipulate, but to understand. And so I even I had before I went into that session to present, you know, these two different visions.
[00:19:32 - 00:19:40]
Courtney DeRonde
I had mocked up this whole slide deck, one slide per partner that said their wiring, their motivation, their Colby,
[00:19:40 - 00:19:45]
Courtney DeRonde
their goals as I saw them going forward from the firm,
[00:19:45 - 00:19:58]
Courtney DeRonde
from what I understood. And I met with each of them and I said, okay, based on all the conversations we've had in the last 18 months, here's what I know about who you are, how you think I feel, how you take action from your assessments.
[00:19:58 - 00:20:20]
Courtney DeRonde
And here's what I believe your goals are going forward. This is what's important to you. This is what matters to you. Does this align with what you believe? Is there anything I'm missing? Is there any kind of misunderstanding? I did that systematically, one by one, with each of my partners. There were eight of us, counting me. When we met, I shared that with everybody.
[00:20:20 - 00:20:48]
Courtney DeRonde
I said, these are. This is who we are. This is how we make decisions instinctively. This is what our goals are. As we go forward. We need to leverage this information to make it easier to collaborate and to make decisions, to play to each other's strengths, to understand. And and that information for me and for all of us was incredibly valuable as we negotiated.
[00:20:48 - 00:21:09]
Courtney DeRonde
Once we agreed, you know, the rest of that time was all spent negotiating. And you know, agreeing on deals and which clients go with this firm and which, you know, team members go with this firm and all of these different things that had to be decided. And we were able to keep going back to this is what we said was important.
[00:21:10 - 00:21:26]
Courtney DeRonde
This is how I know you take action when you, you know, react that way. I know it's because you're wired to think of the worst case scenario. So I'm not going to take it personally. I'm going to help you understand that we've already thought of these things. And so it just it's I think it's so valuable.
[00:21:26 - 00:21:32]
Courtney DeRonde
To have what we call human intelligence, this understanding of people,
[00:21:32 - 00:21:35]
Courtney DeRonde
that for, for me, I'm a CPA.
[00:21:35 - 00:21:42]
Courtney DeRonde
I have an accounting degree. I've been, you know, running an accounting firm that we added management consulting to that. And that's and,
[00:21:42 - 00:22:02]
Courtney DeRonde
but I spent a ton of my professional career working with numbers. And one of the biggest things I understand now is that we don't work with numbers. We work with people. All those numbers represent different people their goals, their visions, their teams, their aspirations, their challenges.
[00:22:03 - 00:22:12]
Courtney DeRonde
We don't work with numbers, we work with people. And that creates a whole nother dimension of leadership.
[00:22:12 - 00:22:13]
Craig Andrews
Wow,
[00:22:13 - 00:22:20]
Craig Andrews
I, I was getting so excited that you were saying that. And I almost responded. And I thought, no, I'm going to hold off because, by the way,
[00:22:20 - 00:22:24]
Craig Andrews
you'll get access to the full episode,
[00:22:24 - 00:22:31]
Craig Andrews
like immediately to download and using way that you want what you just said you need to clip and put out there as so powerful.
[00:22:31 - 00:22:35]
Craig Andrews
Thank you is just so incredibly powerful.
[00:22:35 - 00:22:56]
Craig Andrews
Yeah. I mean, my my training, my formal training is, you know, engineering. I have a master's degree in electrical engineering, and yeah, I've I've stepped on the rail a few times thinking it's about the facts. It's about the data. It's not, I mean, I mean, ultimately, yes, we live in a physical world.
[00:22:56 - 00:22:59]
Craig Andrews
They're guided by the rules of physics.
[00:22:59 - 00:23:02]
Craig Andrews
But we still have to interact with people in the process.
[00:23:02 - 00:23:18]
Courtney DeRonde
Right. And it's not that the numbers don't matter. It's not that those, you know, different things don't matter. But, man, if you only focus on that and forget the real humans that are involved, you just you missed so much of it. We so we have
[00:23:18 - 00:23:32]
Courtney DeRonde
it's you come into our office, there is a wall and it says we don't just work with numbers and it's got photos of our clients so that every day when our team walks in, they're reminded this is what we do.
[00:23:32 - 00:23:40]
Courtney DeRonde
We work for these people, helping them achieve what they're trying to achieve. Yeah, it's not just the numbers.
[00:23:40 - 00:23:42]
Craig Andrews
Well, let's talk about what you do.
[00:23:42 - 00:23:48]
Craig Andrews
Because I'm still a little bit confused. I mean, I love everything you've just said, but what do you do?
[00:23:48 - 00:24:21]
Courtney DeRonde
Yeah. So, so we we're a financial and management consulting company. So on the finance side, we have CPAs, accountants and advisors who provide outsourced controller, CFO and bookkeeping services. We have an audit team who provides external financial reporting. So for companies and organizations that need audited financial statements, we have a team that does that kind of work. And then we have a tax team that does tax planning, tax consulting, tax preparation for those clients.
[00:24:21 - 00:24:28]
Courtney DeRonde
So our tax team only works on the tax work for our audit clients and our outsourced accounting clients. So we don't have
[00:24:28 - 00:24:34]
Courtney DeRonde
that. That was really essentially as we left TD and became forge after that split,
[00:24:34 - 00:24:36]
Courtney DeRonde
we left with a very,
[00:24:36 - 00:24:50]
Courtney DeRonde
heavy tax focus practice. That was one of the things that we were getting away from was doing tax only as an add on service for clients that we're working with in much bigger relationships all year long.
[00:24:50 - 00:25:19]
Courtney DeRonde
As CFO, comptroller, bookkeeping solution or were there audit firm. So that's the financial side of things. The management consulting side of things is really helping those same types of clients but beyond finance. So the money tells the story of what's happening in the business. And if we do our job right on the financial side, we can see what's happening in the organization through the lens of the money.
[00:25:19 - 00:25:42]
Courtney DeRonde
But all that does is uncover decisions that have to be made, changes that have to be executed, leadership that has to be, you know, done. And oftentimes we found that our clients, the more visibility they got in the money, the more stuck they got with, well, what do I do then? This points to a productivity issue that's points to a leadership decision.
[00:25:42 - 00:25:53]
Courtney DeRonde
This points to human intelligence. This you know, and they needed more support. And how do we actually take action on these financial insights that we're getting. And so I created
[00:25:54 - 00:25:57]
Courtney DeRonde
our own proprietary framework. It's called the Simple scale up system.
[00:25:57 - 00:26:06]
Courtney DeRonde
It's a set of principles and tools that we deliver through our flagship coaching program called Scaling Leader.
[00:26:06 - 00:26:22]
Courtney DeRonde
I do some private consulting, some one on one coaching using those same tools. But but that's very limited because it's, you know, based on my capacity. And so primarily those services are delivered through scaling leader where we're working with leaders.
[00:26:22 - 00:26:34]
Courtney DeRonde
They join us, you know, quarter after quarter for workshops where we are systematically helping them to solve the problems that leaders face when they are,
[00:26:34 - 00:26:35]
Courtney DeRonde
successful.
[00:26:35 - 00:26:40]
Courtney DeRonde
And that success has created complexity. And now they need to figure out, you know,
[00:26:40 - 00:26:49]
Courtney DeRonde
you know, what things should I be focused on based on my gifts and strengths? What should I be doing? Or how do I get all of this done? How do I manage my focus and my energy?
[00:26:49 - 00:26:50]
Courtney DeRonde
What numbers should I be looking at?
[00:26:50 - 00:27:05]
Courtney DeRonde
What report should I be looking at? How do I actually delegate and trust someone to do these things for me without sacrificing our, you know, client deliverables or our brand or any, you know, just all these different things.
[00:27:05 - 00:27:17]
Courtney DeRonde
We, we, I pull them together, the different tools and ideas into workshops that we teach 2 or 3 days each quarter that solve those problems, and then those leaders,
[00:27:17 - 00:27:20]
Courtney DeRonde
while we're in the workshop, they're using the tools,
[00:27:20 - 00:27:23]
Courtney DeRonde
you know, installing those things into their system.
[00:27:23 - 00:27:29]
Courtney DeRonde
So it's not just a, it's not a conference. They're not coming to listen and receive and go home with a bunch of homework.
[00:27:29 - 00:27:38]
Courtney DeRonde
They're actually coming and doing working sessions while I'm there. And we've got other coaches there to help answer their questions and guide them through.
[00:27:39 - 00:27:45]
Craig Andrews
Now, there's a lot of people listening. They're going to say, I don't have a couple of days, a quarter to give up that just, you know, I can't pull out.
[00:27:45 - 00:27:47]
Craig Andrews
What would be your response to those?
[00:27:47 - 00:28:18]
Courtney DeRonde
Yeah, I think you're you're probably someone who needs it the most. If that's if that's what you feel. Because and I get that, I understand that. But what we have found is that when leaders intentionally step away from the day to day responsibilities of their business and their personal life and insert themselves into a two day workshop that is hands on, they get more done in those two days than most people get done.
[00:28:18 - 00:28:43]
Courtney DeRonde
If they try to do something themselves or do something virtually because it's a different level of focus and a different level of commitment. And so one of the things that that our clients have told us that is the most valuable is that they have created this rhythm where they show up every quarter. Some of my clients don't even pay attention to what topic we're teaching.
[00:28:43 - 00:29:10]
Courtney DeRonde
They just show up and trust that whatever it is we're going to tell them about or teach them about, whatever they're going to do is going to be relevant and helpful because we've we've earned that, you know, through our content. They're not deciding, do I come this quarter based on what you're talking about? They have established the rhythm of focusing on the business, their leadership, their ability to scale and and star systems every single quarter.
[00:29:10 - 00:29:42]
Courtney DeRonde
And so it's just become a rhythm, something they've automated about their growth and leadership. They don't even think about it. They just show up. And I think one of the biggest, you know, reasons we've got that trust in that transformation is because it is very hands on. We could teach all the sessions in a day, and it can be tempting to do that because you get the response, like you said, like, I don't have two days to, you know, to travel and do that because by the time you travel, you know, maybe you're gone for, you know, part of two other days to get there and to get home.
[00:29:42 - 00:30:03]
Courtney DeRonde
But one of the things that I knew from my experience as a leader and a business owner and a learner, someone who's invested in my own, you know, coaching and growth and development, is it can be really disheartening to invest in training and programs and coaching and feel like you never implement what you learn.
[00:30:03 - 00:30:03]
Craig Andrews
Right?
[00:30:03 - 00:30:28]
Courtney DeRonde
Yeah. And so we just intentionally decided we're going to take a day of content. We're going to teach it over two days because we're going to give them time over after each teaching session to actually use the tools. And so when they go home, they're not doing homework, they're doing cascading to their other leaders and insulation of that.
[00:30:28 - 00:30:31]
Courtney DeRonde
What they've learned and started in the workshop.
[00:30:31 - 00:30:44]
Craig Andrews
Well, I think the other thing that probably happens is when they get out of their normal environment and they get in a different environment, it's enough of a pattern disruption, that opens their mind up to new ideas.
[00:30:44 - 00:31:15]
Courtney DeRonde
Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. We won't even offer a virtual attendance option because I just know people won't get the same value from it. It might be more convenient in theory, but if you can't actually metabolize what you learned and implement what you learned, it won't feel as valuable. The other thing is leadership. Business ownership. It can be isolating. You know, a lot of us have, you know, friends, family members who are not business owners.
[00:31:15 - 00:31:37]
Courtney DeRonde
They don't understand some of the things that we face. So if you can get yourself in an environment every quarter with other people who understand and who are navigating those same challenges, it can be a very valuable community to establish as well. So that's the other benefit that comes from being in person. Over a couple of days. We facilitate dinners,
[00:31:37 - 00:31:39]
Courtney DeRonde
that they can, you know, get connected with each other.
[00:31:39 - 00:32:01]
Courtney DeRonde
And of course, there's time for lunch and breaks. And so just a lot of relationships that get established because you've got like minded people who are dealing with similar challenges. And some of the feedback we get is it's just so helpful to know that I'm not the only one experiencing these these challenges. And these are all successful people.
[00:32:02 - 00:32:20]
Courtney DeRonde
These are established businesses. Right. And so to see like, oh man, these people, you know, they've got a they've got a, you know, $10 million business or they've got a $3 million business or they've got a $50 million business, and they have some of these same challenges too. Okay. This is just what happens when things get more complex.
[00:32:20 - 00:32:26]
Courtney DeRonde
This isn't something that I messed up. This is something I need to learn how to deal with.
[00:32:26 - 00:32:39]
Craig Andrews
Wow, Courtney, this is amazing. I'd love to go for another hour, but we can't. And, But I love what you're doing. How can people reach you?
[00:32:39 - 00:32:40]
Courtney DeRonde
Thank you. Craig.
[00:32:40 - 00:32:46]
Courtney DeRonde
So. Well, I am on LinkedIn. I love to connect on LinkedIn. Courtney Girardi on LinkedIn. I'm a pretty active there. But,
[00:32:47 - 00:32:50]
Courtney DeRonde
I would love for you to check out planningtoscalebook.com.
[00:32:51 - 00:32:58]
Courtney DeRonde
So that's where you can learn more about the book. That is our strategic planning process. And that was born out of,
[00:32:59 - 00:33:02]
Courtney DeRonde
the workshop that we do within our Scaling Leader program.
[00:33:02 - 00:33:08]
Courtney DeRonde
And so planningtoscalebook.com is where you can learn more about that as well.
[00:33:08 - 00:33:10]
Craig Andrews
And that's launching on June 1st.
[00:33:11 - 00:33:13]
Courtney DeRonde
Launching on June 1st. And there will be
[00:33:13 - 00:33:18]
Courtney DeRonde
access to all the tools that we teach and use and the workshops you can download them.
[00:33:18 - 00:33:24]
Courtney DeRonde
After you purchase the book, there will be a URL and a code that you can use to access all those tools and start,
[00:33:24 - 00:33:26]
Courtney DeRonde
applying them yourself.
[00:33:26 - 00:33:29]
Craig Andrews
Excellent. Well, thanks for coming on, Leaders and Legacies.
[00:33:29 - 00:33:39]
Courtney DeRonde
Thanks so much for having me, Craig. Appreciate the conversation.
[00:33:39 - 00:34:01]
Craig Andrews
This is Craig Andrews. I want to thank you for listening to the Leaders and Legacies podcast. We're looking for leaders to share how they're making the impact beyond themselves. If that's you, please go to allies4me.com/guest and sign up there. If you got something out of this interview, we would love you to share this
[00:34:01 - 00:34:03]
Craig Andrews
episode on social media.
[00:34:03 - 00:34:26]
Craig Andrews
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[00:34:26 - 00:34:34]
Craig Andrews
Please go ahead and subscribe. Your thumbs up. Ratings and reviews go a long way to help promote the show. It means a lot to me.
[00:34:34 - 00:34:44]
Craig Andrews
It means a lot to my team. If you want to know more, please go to allies4me.com. Or follow me on LinkedIn. Thanks for listening. We'll see you next time.
